LED Parking and Turn Signal Bulb Question

Home Forums General Discussion LED Parking and Turn Signal Bulb Question

This topic contains 23 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by  secretagentcat 6 months ago.

Viewing 24 posts - 1 through 24 (of 24 total)
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  • #235001

    newkitman
    Participant

    @newkitman

    I have a question on the LED replacement turn signal and parking/tail/stop light bulbs. If I use them will I need to add some resistance to the power lines? I have heard yes and no. Does anyone have a definitive answer?
    Thanks in advancenewkitman2013-12-12 17:58:19

    Allen Caron
    VW based 53MGTD - "MoneyPenny"
    "If one thing matters, everything matters" - from the book The Shack

    #258964

    kentt
    Participant

    @kentt

    Alan, I’ve purchased them for the rear, but haven’t installed them yet. So I don’t have any meaningful input.

    I’m guessing it would be necessary to either add resistance to each side, or get a blinker designed specifically for the lower resistance if you’re using them both front and rear

    Early FF TDr on 69 VW pan
    Slowly coming back from the ashes...

    #258965

    gkesseru
    Participant

    @gkesseru

    Bare LEDs need resistors but packaged LED bulbs generally have built in resistors, but you will need an electronic flasher instead of the heat driven one you now have.

    #258966

    billnparts
    Participant

    @billnparts

    I installed LED front parking lamps and rear LED bulbs. you’ll need to replace your mechanical flasher with an electronic unit. There is not enough resistance in the circuit to trip the mechanical unit. I also found the LED bulbs weren’t very bright and put the conventional bulbs back in.

    Bill Ascheman
    Fiberfab Ford
    Modified 5.0, 5sp., 4:11
    Autocross & Hillclimb
    "Drive Happy"

    #258967

    kentt
    Participant

    @kentt

    Because of the weird way the rear ones mount, without the actual VW taillight housing where the reflector and sockets are recessed, mine had actually melted the rear lens because the bulbs were too close.  Here’s what I’ve bought to solve that issue, but as I said, I haven’t installed them yet…

    They’re supposed to be even brighter than stock, and the brake lights pulse before glowing solid…
    Taillights, turn signals and brake lights all in one…

    KentT2013-12-12 20:19:12

    Early FF TDr on 69 VW pan
    Slowly coming back from the ashes...

    #258968

    pmossberg
    Keymaster

    @pmossberg

    Hmmmm…that looks like the metal backing plates could be trimmed to fit inside original TD taillights or the Lucas L549 taillight.

    Kent, would you please measure the circuit board/LED area?

    PMOSSBERG2013-12-12 23:37:13

    Paul Mossberg
    1982 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
    2005 Intermeccanica Roadster

    If you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to http://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)

    #258969

    kentt
    Participant

    @kentt

    Will try to measure them for you tomorrow, Paul.

    Early FF TDr on 69 VW pan
    Slowly coming back from the ashes...

    #258970

    billnparts
    Participant

    @billnparts

    Now that is a whole different animal. That’ll work much better than just changing the bulbs to LED. Nice find.

    Bill Ascheman
    Fiberfab Ford
    Modified 5.0, 5sp., 4:11
    Autocross & Hillclimb
    "Drive Happy"

    #258971

    kentt
    Participant

    @kentt

    The movie at the link above doesn’t demonstrate the tail light function, nor the turn signals with the tail lights on.  This YouTube movie for the older, 56-61 Bugs does.

    Note that both use a 14-LED array, but the 62-67 has the added circuit that pulses the brake lights.  If the tail lights function the same, I think this will be a good solution.  Using the full size of the tail light, instead of just a segmented compartment like the stock 62-67 does should really increase the amount of light and visibility…

    Early FF TDr on 69 VW pan
    Slowly coming back from the ashes...

    #258972

    edsnova
    Participant

    @edsnova

    Are these actually brighter than the incandescent? 

    #258973

    kentt
    Participant

    @kentt

    edsnova wrote:
    Are these actually brighter than the incandescent? 
    Ed, they don’t specify the lumens so that’s difficult to answer accurately.
    Did you watch the demonstration video?  It was taken in room light, it appears:
    The earlier model bug  uses two LEDs in the center for the tail lights, and 12 more surrounding them for the brake and turn signals. I’m not sure if the configuration for the 62-67  is the same, since it isn’t shown in the video…

    KentT2013-12-13 08:07:33

    Early FF TDr on 69 VW pan
    Slowly coming back from the ashes...

    #258974

    edsnova
    Participant

    @edsnova

    I saw the video, yeah.

    That’s the thing, though. Five years I been watching these vids and reading this LED hype copy in stores and on the interwebs and never once yet have I seen a legit side-by-side comparison. They always slyly suggest and imply that the LEDs are brighter. 
    If they really were I might be moved to invest. . . . 
    #258975

    kentt
    Participant

    @kentt

    Video of their Mustang kit from YouTube, taken in the dark:

    Early FF TDr on 69 VW pan
    Slowly coming back from the ashes...

    #258976

    kentt
    Participant

    @kentt

    Paul,

    The LED array that’s mounted to the metal plate is 4-3/8″ x 1-1/2″ 

    Early FF TDr on 69 VW pan
    Slowly coming back from the ashes...

    #258977

    pmossberg
    Keymaster

    @pmossberg

    Thank you Kent.

     
    If you have been behind a production car with LED tailights, I think you’ll agree the LEDs are much brighter. And they have an additional advantage in that they are instant on. Granted that advantage is probably fractions of a second…but faster is better.
     
    I gotta believe the 14 LEDs are brighter than the standard 1157 bulb.

    Paul Mossberg
    1982 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
    2005 Intermeccanica Roadster

    If you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to http://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)

    #258978

    edsnova
    Participant

    @edsnova

    I don’t.

    A car made in 2011 with standard LEDs–yeah, brighter than my car, by a lot.

    But it does not follow that an aftermarket kit, inserted inside my 1950 TD taillight housing, will do as well. Or even that it will do better than the 1157 that is there now.

    That’s why I’d like to see at least a standard output rating in lumens. Then we could start to compare.

    #258979

    kentt
    Participant

    @kentt

    I’m certainly not an engineer, nor did I sleep in a Holiday Inn last night, but:

    1.  For those of us running VW-type lens, instead of TD-type, there is also the added benefit that the center metal partition on the lens is removed, making one larger compartment, instead of two smaller ones.  Consequently, light from the LEDs is visible from much broader viewing angles… it is not compartmentalized.

    2.  They appear to use only 2 LEDs to “replace” the tail light filament of the 1157 bulb and all 14 are used for the brake or signal light — a 7:1 ratio.  According to this link, an 1157 has a 5-8 watt element and a  21 watt element — more like a 3:1 to 5:1 ratio.   So, the difference when the brakes or turn signal comes on would definitely be more noticeable, regardless of the starting point.  
    3.  An array of auto-quality LEDs like this is significantly different that a much smaller set of LEDs designed to insert in the original socket.  Compare a 40 watt 4-foot long fluorescent tube to a 40  watt fluorescent screw-in bulb replacement. Though each might put our the same amount of light, how it is viewed is totally different, IMO. 
    4.  This link shows the output of at least one brand of the direct replacement LED lights for 1157 sockets puts our 240 lumens.  http://www.etrailer.com/question-47958.html. I also would like to know the lumen output for this array we’re talking about, to be able to more closely compare…

    KentT2013-12-13 18:27:06

    Early FF TDr on 69 VW pan
    Slowly coming back from the ashes...

    #258980

    newkitman
    Participant

    @newkitman

    The two bulbs I bought are dual bulb LEDs. Each bulb is supposed to replace the tail/brake light. I’ll just stick with the 1157 for the turn signals and the park/turn lights up front. Nothing with the bulbs or on the box mentions adding resistance so I guess I’m good. Thanks folks for all the info and replies.

    Allen Caron
    VW based 53MGTD - "MoneyPenny"
    "If one thing matters, everything matters" - from the book The Shack

    #303632

    stephenhouser
    Keymaster

    @stephenhouser

    Reviving this thread as I just installed these LED tail lights to replace the incandescent ones this evening. Still need to get some rubber grommets to cover up the holes.

    The LED tail light
    Installed
    Light ’em up!
    Light Off from the back
    Light on for comparison
    Side View light off
    And side view with the light on, for comparison

     

    Buxton, Maine
    1982 London Roadster - "Kit Kat"

    #303634

    kall
    Participant

    @kall

    I’m reposting this in the hope of  shedding more light on the current discussion: 😕

    “<i>I came across a few bits of information which may help members evaluate LED replacement lamps.
    </i>

    <i>Since most LED replacement lamps are rated in lumens (a measure of light output) comparison to watts is best left to the engineers. A more useful comparison for us mortals is:</i>

    <i>#194 bulb (common in marker lights and instrument panels) has an output of approximately 24 lumens. Therefore to find an LED replacement of comparable brightness you should look for one with about 24 lumens at 12 volts. Likewise, an #1156 bulb (single filament tail light lamp or I presume one filament of a #1157 stop & tail) is rated at 400 lumens.</i>

    <i>I know that there are many other parameters such as beam angle, actual socket voltage etc. but I hope this will provide a frame of reference.”</i>

    💡

    #303644

    pmossberg
    Keymaster

    @pmossberg

    Stephen,

    I love your car’s color!

    Are the LED taillights split between turn signal, and running/brake light?

    And does your stock turn signal switch still work? Or did you have to replace it?

    • This reply was modified 6 months, 2 weeks ago by  pmossberg.

    Paul Mossberg
    1982 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
    2005 Intermeccanica Roadster

    If you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to http://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)

    #303648

    stephenhouser
    Keymaster

    @stephenhouser

    @pmossberg I had the car repainted several years back. The original got beat up by the South Florida sun over it’s first 15 years of life. The paint job isn’t perfect, there’s a bit of “orange peel” and a few defects. Nothing I can’t live with.

    I like the color too 🙂

    The tail lights are good and bad.

    • They are nice and bright (good)
    • I’m not getting the ‘hyper-blink’ too badly. They are usable as-is but a resistor might help (meh)
    • Activating the turn signal “takes over” the light. E.g. if the brakes are on, both lights are on, when you hit the turn signal that light “blinks” completely off and on (bad)

    To install I had to remove the separator in the tail light lens. A small metal plate in mine that separated the turn and running/brake light.

    So far the stock switch/relay works without too much trouble. I did not have to replace anything other than the light sockets and mounting.

    I may, with my infinite time on the planet, take to design my own replacement that does not have these problems. Then I can accumulate another 1,000 LEDs and play more with micro controllers, which is always fun to do. …or maybe just give feedback to the original designer about the changes I’d like to see.

     

    Buxton, Maine
    1982 London Roadster - "Kit Kat"

    #303649

    stephenhouser
    Keymaster

    @stephenhouser

    Here’s a link to the LED replacement manufacturer Technostalgia

    Buxton, Maine
    1982 London Roadster - "Kit Kat"

    #303666

    secretagentcat
    Participant

    @secretagentcat

    The collective brain power of this club is amazing! Weve really got some smart cookies here! The lights look great! I just used the packaged led for my tail lights.

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