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Gang
Well, I’m at least back home after a short trip on a flat bed tow rig. Nice cruise until about 10 miles out, then dead….. Checked fuel, OK. Seemed it sounded different when cranking, like it had no spark. Had a friend bring out my spare duraspark module and coil, hooked em up and had spark to the plugs. Still seems to sound like it is turning over at much faster speed. Has compression coming out the exhaust but seems like it’s got no sign of spark. Timing belt still in one piece and turning the top end pulley.
Has it jumped time???? Is that possible with the belt still on??? Maybe the dissy gear slipped??? Is it possessed???
I know you guys will give me the right direction to head in but I’ll also need help convincing the wife to trust it again once it’s fixed
Thanks in advance for your ideas and input. I’m sure together we’ll have Nadine back running soon. In the mean time I’ve still got to take the missus to dinner.
Down, but not out,
Ringo
Hi gang,
My first practical use of the registry that I keep pestering about.
Ringo’s (aka Steve) Duchess has a 2.3 L Ford.
I’m ashamed to admit this, but I once failed to properly tighten the distributor hold down bolt on my 65 Plymouth. Of course the distributor moved, threw off the timing and engine went dead. Just a thought, although I am sure Steve is smarter than me.
Ringo, did it die while at speed? Or did it stall when you slowed or stopped? I’m just digging for a few more clues that might help the group diagnosis.
Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
Ringo,
If it has spark and compression and the timing belt is in place that certainly eliminates a few most likelies. I suppose it’s possible for rhe timing belt to JUMP, but that’s highly unlikely. Have you fully eliminated fuel problems? Is the electric fuel pump working? Should be easy to check.
Good Luck!
Rich
If you have a spark on cyl No 1 get out the timing light and see if it’s close with engine just cranking? or can you manually find TDC and manually rotate the crank to see when you get the spark, not sure?
I haven’t checked anything else since last night. The tow driver offered the idea that there’s some drive off the belt system that works the dissy and thus the possible jumping time (?). This is my first OHC so I’ll have to get the basics down for checking it out.
It was running well at 40 MPH, then nothing. No hiccup, no backfire, no missing then dying, just dead. The electric fuel pump is working, there’s a good spray of gas when cranking, (come to think of it, it seems that gas droplets were spraying up out of the carb when crankin). Compression is relative, my bud just held his hand over the exhaust while I cranked and he said he felt pressure. I wasn’t able to pull a plug there at roadside. Spark from wire to ground was kinda yellow but jumped a good 1 inch.
The faster cranking speed and the feeling it was giving no real compression sound started immediately when it got pulled off the roadside. Strange sound that made me think Uh-Oh, that’s different.
I think I’ll pull the plug first and check compression at the block, After that I hook up the timing light. Then I’ll start taking stuff off to get to the distributor, if it slipped on the mounting it wouldn’t surprise me since it’s so well hidden.
I’ll keep yall posted, but in meantime if any more thoughts come up pass ’em along.
Ringo
BTW, even on the tow truck, it got honks and thumbs up.
Ringo, Remove the #1 sparkplug,reattach the wire and ground the plug to the engine and hold your finger over the sparkplug hole while someone cranks the engine. The plug should fire at the same time you feel compression at the plug hole .From looking at the picture of your engine I can see that getting to the distributor is difficult ,this may give you some clues without too much trouble.
Ringo,
Let’s start an engine frustration club, we can’t start the engines, might as well start a club
. On my 2.3L, the slightest movement of the timing belt tensioner made the belt jump a notch or two, easily.My baby is still hanging out waiting for me to put the engine back together. Keep us posted on your findings. Paul, the registry is a wonderful thing. I am so glad you thought of getting it going. Great idea!
James
After you do what Larry said…there is a shaft driven by the timing belt that drives the distributor and the fuel pump. In all my years, I’ve never seen one of these fail on a 2.3L Ford Lima.
I’ve seen fuel pumps fail, distributor parts fail, coils fail, rarely a timing belt failure either.
Jumping timing usually happens when the timing belts are well worn an at higher RPM. It could jump at the crank, distributor drive or the camshaft. Re-clocking the distributor is easy enough if the belt jumped at the distrbutor/fuel pump drive.
I have seen early production 2.3L Ford Lima’s eat cam lobes pretty regularly, but they gradually run like crap, losing a cylinder at time until they die. I doubt that’s what you problem is.
I’d pull the distributor cap and get the crank to TDC and see if the rotor is still aimed at #1 and the cam s still lined up. Make sure the distributor shaft doesn’t turn freely.
I used to test spark by putting my finger in the spark plug boot…but that was in the days of weak coils and points. Now I have this wire with a light in it that gets “spliced” in the plug wire.
I’ll GUESS fuel pump, trigger module in the distributor or bad coil at this time…let us know what it is…we can’t wait
I think all these cars suffer from 30+ year old donor parts, so we can expect posts like this to be normal.
Re:
“…even on the tow truck, it got honks and thumbs up…..”
I bet most people thought it was an original (since it was on a tow truck)! ha!
Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
Update
Gave it a short crank over when I got home. Gas is sprayin up out of the carb. Not a leak… an atomized like spray. Somethings way out of time to do that.
Paul, the distributor seems tight, can’t pull it up or twist by hand.
I’ll cut off the gas and drain the float bowl for safety then try the other stuff to cover all the angles. ie, check timing at #1, etc.
Thanks again….Gotta love this group!
Ringo
Ringo40038.7766898148
Ringo ; I had a GEO different engine but the timing belt jumped, the tensioner went bad and jumped half the belts teeth on a third gear shift. The belt was only 6 mo old being a noninterference head all was ok after I put it back together I will never change one without the other again. GOOD LUCK
Dan and gang;
Yeah, I’m thinking whatever is going on I’m looking at replacing most everything I run into. Once I tear into it I might as well R&R as much as I can, other wise I’m looking at not trusting her again and that would be a shame.
If this were winter time I’d feel better about this, I hate missing good driving weather.
Ringo
How true. But working on ’em is fun too.
And were it winter, us northerners would be freezing our fingers off (and other critical body parts), except for the lucky ones with heated garages,
Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
Usually my cars ONLY break down when it’s either 10 below or 100 plus, and either snowing or raining. I dropped my Scout’s rear driveshaft on the interstate just east of Knoxville at 75 miles an hour in a rain storm. I gathered pieces of U-joints, shaft and mufflers off the interstate in the downpour for half an hour, engaged the front axle and drove on. Took me a week to dry out. Every car I own has broken down in the worst weather except when my MGTD replica broke down, it was a beautiful day. That’s why I couldn’t believe it was broken, the weather was perfect. Goes to show how different these babies are.
.Ringo, keep us posted on your findings. I need to get back your way soon, I need a Hot Springs fix! Sounds like you need one too.
James
My 2 cents says it’s the timming belt.They don’t jump persay.What generally happens is a few teeth on the belt break off and boom jumped timming.Routine maintenance on the belt drive motors is 30,000-50,000 miles.Most people will generally wait till the belt fails,but then there is usually more damage at that point.My advise if it is the belt,replace all the timming belt components while you are in there,tensioner,idler pulley,and water pump if it’s driven by the timming belt.Sure it will cost a little more.But you will be able to sleep at night.
Well Ringo , I hope you can get her back on the road soon waiting till winter would drive me crazy ! but at least we are not in the northern states and have a little longer driving time. I like the chill ! not the freezing cold . Dan
James;
Finishing up some other projects around the house before I get started tearing it down. I’ve got her on some dollies so I can move her around until I can get serious. I’m thinking I’ll get started next week. I’m 99% sure it’s the belt dropping a few teeth or something along that line, so I’m committed to changing out everything, from the radiator hoses, to thermostat housing, to water pump while I’m doing the belt. Shoot, I might just replace the distributor too. I’m making a list of parts and reading as many online posts about timing set up as I can, so I won’t have to get stressed about it. I may get it done in 2 weeks or it may take 2 months! (hopefully the former).
I’ll let yall know what I find when I tear into it.
Ringo
To set the timing was a piece of cake on my 2.3L, did the alignment marks including the drive to the distributor and setting the rotor to the #1. Release the tensioner easily, verify the alignments, turn over the engine, verify the alignments again. Put it all together and pray.
I hit mine perfect the first time. She roared to life and purred smoothly. I was stressed about the belt. I had replaced timing chains on several of my other cars, but had never done the belt. I also have a list of items to replace while I am into my engine. I have the timing belt illustrations in one of my computers, I could send those to you if you like. Generally, but not always, it’s the least expensive part that goes bad first…like the belt….but they also tend to be the hardest to get to.
Wonder why they do that? Take the cheapest part and build an engine around it. James
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