January 30, 2012 at 5:07 pm #233951greg pressParticipant
When i got my car i checked oil it looked clean got in and had a great time.This year i will do things right .I have some question.
1.What weight and kind of oil do you use in 1600cc vw air cooled engine.How often do you change it
2.What kind of spark plugs and wires? [thought about ordering green wires from taylor.]
3.How often do you change the point,plugs and condenser.Should it be timed at this time.
Its been many years since i did this any advise will help. I did all my own work on a 1964 pontiac catilina and a 1965 ford falcon when i was 18 years old THINK SPRING!!!!!!January 30, 2012 at 6:39 pm #248892
1. You will get all sorts of recommendations on oil. The more you ask, the more comments. VW recommends multigrade. In your climate 10W40 is a good choice. I run Castrol GTX. Every 2000 miles is what I do but once again it depends on a lot of variables. At least every 3000 miles with dropping the screen and cleaning it also.
2. I run readily available and popular NGK B5HS plugs. The best plugs will vary somewhat depending on the condition of your engine, ambient temperature, carburetor adjustment and the overall state of your tune. (MiGi used to have B6HS but am running B5HS now.) Wires ???
3. It makes me feel good to change the points, plugs and condenser every spring. Since changing the points will also require regapping them, you have thereby changed timing. So, yes it is a great idea to time the engine after changing points. Don’t forget to adjust your carburetor and carefully follow the timing instructions for your particular distributor.January 31, 2012 at 7:18 am #248893Scott A ChynowethParticipant
My coice for oil this time around.Fresh 1641 build.
I went with a fleet farm brand diesel oil.
my concerne is that todays oils are designed for todays engines,LESS of the antifriction additives(mainly zinc) for flat tappet cams,and more detergents that plug up the cat,wich we don’t have.
I was just searching oils for old engines this morning,and will be leaning toward 4 stroke motorcycle oil next time.Motorcycles don’t have strict emission standards and no cats.Also air cooled so is VW so the oil should have good thermal breakdown protection.January 31, 2012 at 8:00 am #248894
From all my reading, lack of zinc is the main concern in new oils. I, too, would be using air cooled motorcycle oil if I could afford it. Very pricey. If you find one that is even close to the automotive oils in price, I’d like to know. I usually run 20W50, but that was before I changed oil pumps to a 26mm Schadek from a worn out stock one. I will be trying 10W40 on my next change.January 31, 2012 at 8:37 am #248895
I’ve got Valvoline 20-50 racing oil in there now, with extra ZDDP. I think 10-40 would be better though, except for maybe July-August.
Change it at 2000 miles or so. I think I did 2350 or so with the full synthetic I accidentally bought last year (Royal Purple; didn’t read the label). By 2000 she’d used half a quart so I needed to top up. I put in Marvel, further thinning it. Probably that was a mistake…. But didn’t seem to bother my 1500(?) SP. Small is beautiful.
So from now on I think it’s going to be RP or Valvoline 10-40 ZDDP. Supposedly (according to the Speedster guys) Brad Penn is better. But so many of those guys run such ridiculous grenades in their cars (2176s, 2332s, etc), with such predictable results, that I have concluded that building a Type 1 VW to such dimensions is folly, and everything those guys say they do to make them “reliable” is b.s. By my observation, they make them reliable by replacing their engines every 4000 miles or so. Generally at a cost of $5000 and up.
What’s that got to do with us? Nothing, I should hope. Keep your engine under two liters and get serious about cooling and oil volume if you get above 1776 or so. Or if you make a slip-in 1641, which might want to run hot because of the thin cylinder walls.
Plugs: Bosch or NGK. Wires? stock 7 mm. The eights won’t help and are harder to fit. Be meticulous and patient with those umbrella seals that go into the tins. Get a good tight fit.
Points and condenser? Probably file gap or replace ’em every 2000 miles or so but I think stowe them under the seat and buy a Pertronix module. Don’t get a high energy coil with that though–use the stock blue Bosch one. It works fine.
Set your timing static to about TDC (various Type 1’s in stock form were static timed anywhere from 10 before to 10 after. She’ll run at 0 and then you can play with it for best performance). If you want, set the full advance to no more than 28 degrees at about 3000 RPM. The total being 28 degrees matters more than the RPM. If you get 28 degrees as of 2600 RPM, and it runs fine, that’s fine, so long as it won’t advance beyond 28 degrees.
If the car runs hot or pings at 28 degrees total, retard the timing a bit, then go looking for the real problem.
If you keep your points, get a tach & dwell meter and set the dwell. Start with a feeler gauge at .016″ at the top of one of the lobes, which will get you very close (good enough for me for two years). Attach the dwell meter, start her up and set it to 50 degrees, more or less. At .016 you should be there. If you’re high, shut ‘er down and gap them again, opening the points just a smidge. If the dwell reads low, shut off and set the points a tiny bit closer together.
After the points are gapped right, THEN you set your timing. I’ve been using a test light to set it with the engine shut down. Again, with my lo-po engine that’s worked OK at 5 before TDC. With any kind of ambitious build, it’s probably mandatory to set it dynamically at 28 degrees, all in.
Then on to the carb(s).
BTW, gap your tappets (actually rocker-to-valve stem) clearance on your first oil change, and then check it thereafter about every other oil change (4000 miles, say) or if she starts making funny noises. Unless you have certain kinds of non-stock pushrods, .006″ is the setting you want.January 31, 2012 at 8:54 am #248896
Ed, Which distributor do you have? I was planning to set the advance at 28-32 favoring 32 (assuming that it ran well). If all goes well today, I will put my “new” 231 137 035 stock SVA in and keep my 009 in my trunk with points set and ready to go as a spare.January 31, 2012 at 12:17 pm #248897
Vacuum advance. Don’t understand this general attachment to the 009.
I keep the point kit in the car and actually used it last year when she conked out on the way to Bug Out in Manassas. Turned out to be a bad coil, but the swap did work. I swapped it back after I got home.
You might get away with more than 30 degrees total timing, or even a few degrees more, but you should listen hard for signs of detonation or pre-ignition. My philosophy is to be conservative. There’s a reason you don’t see these cars racing at Indy, and the performance benefits of a few degrees earlier spark are very small, while the damage that can be done by pinging is very large and can happen fairly quickly.January 31, 2012 at 1:27 pm #248898
Ed, I’m going from a 009 (100% centrifugal) to a 231 137 035 (100% vacuum) advance distributor as a bit of an experiment. I am taking out a 009 that was timed at max advance of 30-32 degrees. I only get about 23 mpg and do have a slight hesitation when passing through 2300rpm on accelleration. It’s not too bad, – I’m just playing. I usually carry spare points, plugs, condenser, coil, cap, rotor, and even a long ignition wire. Lately, I’ve been trying to figure out how to collapse my tow bar so I could stow it under the hood. One might assume that I break down regularly. Actually the opposite is true, -don’t remember the last time that I did. (But if I do, I’m gonna be ready. This is my mindset left over from the 1950’s out in the country where cell phones don’t even work.)January 31, 2012 at 3:26 pm #248899
Ahh, the dreaded 009 “flat spot.”
If you figure out the tow bar thing let us know. I carry a random assortment of tools right now, but intend this spring to correct my carry-on to conform closely to Muir’s “stage 2” tool kit. Anything beyond that i figure is why AAA exists.January 31, 2012 at 11:02 pm #248900greg pressParticipant
e-mailed gbdick his car front end is the same as mine.Somehow they were able to put vw tow bar on it.He lives 5 or 6 hrs from me.
think springFebruary 1, 2012 at 9:02 am #248901Larry MurphyParticipant
Greg, MGLondonRoadster has the same front end. He had a VW tow bar modified at a local welding shop to fit this type suspension. It took him a couple of trips to the shop to get it to fit but he said it worked out in the end.
I think another member welded brackets to the car’s suspension to attach the VW tow bar . I don’t know if the tow bar ends had to be reworked to hook to the brackets or if they were designed to fit .February 1, 2012 at 10:56 am #248902MarkParticipant
Yes, I bought a relatively affordable used VW tow bar, and found that its original U shaped axle troughs did not fit my squared off axles.
It took a couple of trips, but now the reinforced bar slips right on without any trouble.
with my old unreliable engine in her, I just left the tow bar on. When she broke down, I got a ride home and picked her up with my Odyssey. I haven’t since taken her out, but now that the engine has been out for a rebuild for about 4 months, now, I’ll leave the tow bar on for my first forrays around town once she is running again.
Muir’s book used the 3 month, 3,000 mile guidelline for oil changes, I thought. More frequently if you live in a hot or dusty environment. I never dropped the screen before on my bug in my earlier days, so that will be a new habit to get into.February 1, 2012 at 6:59 pm #248903
You can re-use the screen if you clean it (I shot some starter fluid on it last time), but you maybe still need to buy the gasket kit with the little brass/copper washers & stuff, and a new screen comes with.
Or I guess you could use form-a-gasket and save $8 on the kit . . .
I cleaned my screen because the new one looked like a wider mesh, and I figured finer is better.February 2, 2012 at 9:16 am #248904Richard ShearParticipant
according to my stock VW friends. The oil they use is a ZDDP oil that is high in Zinc because of the flat tappets. They recommended Brad Penn Racing oil. I went on ebay and bought mine. You can get multi viscosity or straight weight. Depends on where you live as to what weight oil you need.
DickFebruary 2, 2012 at 6:01 pm #248905MikeParticipant
I started using Brad Penn racing oil last year. It is a partial synthetic. I noticed a slight oil temperature drop over the castrol. I will stick with the Brad Penn even though I have to buy it online.February 2, 2012 at 8:24 pm #248906
Ed, thanks for the tip on Valvoline. Recently, I have been reading a lot about ZDDP and oils. Spent a couple of hours today at a variety of auto stores trying to find oils which even mention ZDDP. I only looked at 10W40 and 20W50 oils and only dino oil since synthetics are so expensive. I considered going with a 4 stroke motorcycle oil but finally decided to go with the Valvoline 20W50 VR1 Racing Oil. I had a lot of difficulty finding an oil that even mentioned zinc or ZDDP. This Valvoline says “ashless anti wear additives and ZDDP provide ultimate wear protection” and it gets good reviews from air cooled Porsche/VW and motorcycle users on line. So, when my oil change gasket set comes in, the Valvoline oil gets a try.
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