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Allen,
Do you know what the measurement should be?
Or is this not an exact science?PMOSSBERG2012-08-18 21:04:14
Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
I’m not Allen (
) but remember from working on a Ford V8 flathead (adjusted by adding or subtracting gaskets), it is guesswork. (But that was before the wealth of knowledge that one has readily available today on the internet.) According to my Orange Bentley Manual, Chapter 2, page 7:
Turn the engine by hand until the fuel pump shaft reaches its highest point
Measure the distance the shaft projects above the intermediate flange.The pushrod should project 13-mm (1/2-inch) If not add or remove gaskets under the intermediate flange to obtain that dimension.Sometimes I have no gasket and have to lightly sand the intermediate shaft to remove just a gasket thickness to get the correct dimension.newkitman2012-08-18 23:10:34
Allen Caron
VW based 53MGTD - "MoneyPenny"
"If one thing matters, everything matters" - from the book The ShackThanks Roy
Thanks AllenPaul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
Paul,
Rob & Dave seem to disagree with Bentley (http://www.vw-resource.com/fuel_pump.html#test) about the desired push rod length. You may have to referee this inexact science.Yeah, I had read Rob & Dave’s page too. This is the first time I have ever had even a slight doubt about something on their page. The only replacement rods I have seen are 4″ and 4 1/4″.
And this paragraph has an obvious error:
Note:
The fuel pump used with an alternator uses a 4″ pushrod. The fuel
pump used with a generator used a 4-1/2″ pushrod. However, to make it
more complicated SOME 15 degree-angle pumps can have the lever/arm way
up in there and actually need a 4-1/4″ pushrod. Make sure you have a
pushrod of the correct length for your system.They say there are 4″ and 4 1/2″. But then say “some” pumps with a lever “way up there”and need a 4 1/4”. I suspect that should have read that there are standard 4″ and 4 1/4″, and that some odd ball pumps need a 4 1/2″
A new pump is $15. And the rod is $4. That’s a cheap enough to take the chance on just swapping the old one out.
Stay tuned.
PMOSSBERG2012-08-19 19:17:42
Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
Keep on going Paul. You’ll lick it yet. What’s left after you get her running?
Allen Caron
VW based 53MGTD - "MoneyPenny"
"If one thing matters, everything matters" - from the book The ShackAllen…NOTHING.
Except the occasional tinkering!A quick history….I built this car in 1982. Put the 1641 in about ten years later.Blew that motor up a couple years ago on the way to Carlisle. I didn’t know it, but a mouse had built a nest under the cooling tin. With no airflow over one cylinder, after about fifty miles, I burned a quarter inch hole through the head. Pretty damn impressive for the work of a friggin’ mouse!The 1776, for the miles I drove it, is awesome. Just the right engine for how I use the car.Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
Before you go and start messing with the fuel pump and rod length, have you cranked over the engine and seen or measured just how much your existing pump puts out? (Pump it out through a longer line into a bucket or fuel can).
Or you can even try a gravity feed from a fuel can into the carbs and see if it will run. If the carbs are clean and functioning, the bowls will fill and shut off the excess flow via the needle valves as in a normally operating fuel supply and you won’t be dripping gas all over the place.Haven’t done a gravity feed.
But gas is simply not getting to the carbs.Bowls in both carbs were bone dry.All fuel lines are clean.Thirty seconds of cranking does move some gas into a container. But obviously not enough.Push rod is correct length and depending on the resource, is moving the correct amount.I may be wrong, but I think I’ve ruled out just about everything but the pump.And if I’m wrong, it will only have cost me $15 to find out.Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
Paul: Have you checked the idle fuel shutoff wire from + side of the coil? Shut off kills fuel to carbs. A break in the wire would cause both carbs to not have fuel in them. Quick check if it is working is to turn key on to run position, then pull wire off of idle cut off solenoid on carb. a click should be heard when you touch disconnected wire to solenoid. If no click is heard, solenoid is bad or no power to solenoid. Key on should have 12 volts at solenoid.
Dry bowls can be due to stuck or dirty needle valves not letting any gas get into the carbs.
Have you checked the floats and needle valves in the carbs for smooth operation? Like the valves aren’t stuck shut prohibiting gas from flowing?
If you take off the tops of the carbs and touch the needle valves, they should move up (closed) with no resistance and should fall down (open) when you let go, and you should also be able to blow air through them into the carbs when they are open. If they don’t freely move, that could be one of the problems. And if you hook up a gravity feed to the the carbs you can easily see if they are clean and working or not.
Maybe you just need a good carb clean.Everything was moving freely.
And not the same as a fluid, but air flowed freely through the gas lines into the carbs.
Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
On a side note all it takes is a pin hole on the pump diaphram,or a crack from dry age.CHECK THE OIL what fuel isn’t going to the carbs has got to be going some place.
The latest…
Replaced the fuel pump, primed the carbs, engine turned over and caught. So that’s a slight improvement.
But it stumbles, pops, backfires, and will barely idle.
Rechecked the point gap and timing, both are where they should be.
The floats are fine and move freely. The needle vales are fine and also move freely. Air does flow through when I hold the needle valves open.
What next?
On the up side, I have my 65 Plymouth running perfectly. Her problem turned out to be a bad distributor. Bushings worn, allowed the point gap and timing to fly all over the place.
Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
Run it a bit and see if she settles down.
I know you’ve built these motors and so you know what you’re doing, but something sounds wrong, spark-timing-wise. Maybe gap the points on every lobe with a feeler gauge? Just make sure something didn’t go haywire in the disty?
Paul, You seem to have confidence in the timing and the distributor. Assuming that the carbs are ok, could you possibly have crossed 2 plug wires?
This problem you’re having is kinda like a TV series with each episode leaving you hanging till the next episode. I anxiously await the next episode to see how it turns out. This has been a real mystery. I’m hoping the finale is soon for you. Summer is coming quickly to a close.
Paul,
Like the song says, “Start from the very beginning”. With engine off, reset all settings on both carbs. Make certain that they are set alike. Then readjust the accelerator cable so it moves BOTH throttle at the same time. Next check both chokes and make certain they are both connected and when you step on the accelerator they both move to the same notch on the lever. Then start her up and tweak from there. Interesting saga but I’ve got confidence that you’ll find the issue and rectify it.Allen Caron
VW based 53MGTD - "MoneyPenny"
"If one thing matters, everything matters" - from the book The ShackPaul, just a random thought, check the dist cap too. I remember waaay back in auto shop in high school, we had a test trying to diagnose a engine problem that was runnin rough. Turned out the teacher had taken a pencil and marked the electrodes with the lead graffite. New cap it ran fine , I totaly missed it. There might be just enough crossion or dust or ??? to mess it up. Just a random idea.
That’s part of the frustration…everything in the ignition chain is new, cap, rotor, points, condenser, plugs, plug wires. All new and correctly installed.
Engine WAS running. Then stumbled and died.
Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
Paul, I know you have pumped fuel into a container,but have you checked the output PRESSURE of the new pump? The sputtering and backfiring could be symptoms of not enough fuel getting to the carbs.
I had an old Beetle that I rebuilt and had the same problem on reassembly. Turns out I had plug wires crossed. Couldn’t be that easy could it?
I wish. But no. Other than taking them off one at a time when I checked the plugs, the wires are right where they were when the engine was running fine.
Didn’t spend much time on it on Sunday. Instead I took the Plymouth for a long, top-down ride to clear my mind! I’d say a wind in the hair ride, but that would be lying.
Paul Mossberg
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica RoadsterIf you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)
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