October 19, 2013 at 5:01 pm #234949
Look what Santa Fed Ex just delivered:This is the Kennedy Engineered Products adapter plate, flywheel, “Stage II” pressure plate and the hi-torque starter needed to put an EJ22/EJ25 on a VW Type 1 Transaxle.I also have a shorter oil pan and pickup and a low-miles 1995 Legacy wagon: 2.2 liters, four valves-per-cylinder and rated at 135 HP @ 5800 rpm, 137 ft-lbs torque @ 4800 rpm.Still be needin’: sparks (That’d be an early 1990s Ford EDIS4 and 36-1 cog wheel, MegaJolt crankfire ignition thingamabob . . .)Fuel system: leaning toward using the stock FI; will need some tank mods and a high=pressure fuel pump. Still studying this.Cooling: still figuring out what sort of radiator I’ll be adapting to this.Many sundries.From time to time I will post progress photos and laments on this thread. Well-wishing encouraged, as well as constructive criticism and righteous mockery.I am well-used to the mockery. It seems to motivate me.
edsnova 2013-10-20 19:54:29October 19, 2013 at 5:29 pm #258017
It will be exciting to follow your progress! I intend to install a 1.9 wasserboxer into mine, similar to the way this buggy was done http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=130150
I likely will use a standard beetle manifold with a single 34mm solex. my object is to acheive the liquid cooled engine along with it’s advantages not any real quest for more horsepower! The water cooled engine runs much quieter than it’s air cooled cousin.October 19, 2013 at 5:39 pm #258018RoyalParticipant
Crikey, you’re really gonna do it. I really thought that you were just joshin’ and dreaming. I think that’s great!I’d love to be there and supervise and critique (one of the things that I do best – I’m told).I’m sure that you will run into a few glitches here and there but it will be fun.Are you going to overhaul the engine first? Or at least take compression readings on it? I assume the radiator gets mounted in front. You probably will have to go with one that will fit into the space available. I would guess that you would have no problem cooling and I wouldn’t be concerned about it unless you move to Phoenix. I would be interested in how you are going to open up the louvers? If I had a lift, I might be tempted to do the same as you but bending over and getting up and down the required 500 times would be torture.I assume that you intend to start the day that you get home from Carlisle 2004.I am looking for a winter project, what do you want for your old 1300-1600?Best of luck on your new project. (I talked at some length to the Porsche guy that had a Subi in it 2 years ago.) I love the idea.
Royal2013-10-19 17:57:21October 19, 2013 at 5:45 pm #258019sreynoldsParticipant
Ed, this should be a very interesting project. Hurry up and get started!!
SamOctober 19, 2013 at 7:24 pm #258020billnpartsParticipant
Remember the 300+hp Scooby flat 4 in the Manx at Carlisle? That swap is going to be sweet!
Modified 5.0, 5sp., 4:11
Autocross & Hillclimb
"Drive Happy"October 19, 2013 at 8:27 pm #258021Dale SchumacherParticipant
Looking forward to watching this winter.October 19, 2013 at 9:07 pm #258022
Thanks, Boy-os.Roy, this job is already starting; I plan on pulling the Soob either tomorrow or the week after next (there’s an A/C system I need to either drain or move out the way). And yeah I’ll do the cam belt and have a look at the motor, but she’s only showing about 80k on the odo & runs smooth and smoke-free so I am not planning on getting into her guts unless I see some concerning things when I pull off the oil pan.Hey one thing I forgot to mention: I got a nearby guy says he’ll rebuild and strengthen my transaxle for $400 over a weekend, but to get the strongest outcome and the best possible gear ratios–including a 3.88 R&P–he suggests I find a 1973 or later Bug tranny to overhaul.I’ve been looking but so far ain’t got one. So if anyone sees one for short money–or knows where one is sitting on someone’s bench somewhere–give me a PM.October 20, 2013 at 3:43 am #258023billnpartsParticipant
Ed, at about 140k it WILL require head gaskets. On the back of the block is a plastic separator plate that becomes brittle and cracks. Newer models have a metal plate. Replace it when you have her out.
Modified 5.0, 5sp., 4:11
Autocross & Hillclimb
"Drive Happy"October 20, 2013 at 9:52 am #258024john barryParticipant
Ed looking forward to the Soob swab pictures! Hell I dont even know what a Soob is! 😛October 20, 2013 at 10:26 am #258025newkitmanParticipant
Soob=Subaru. I didn’t know they made that large an engine. Learning all the time. 🙂 newkitman2013-10-20 10:28:20
VW based 53MGTD - "MoneyPenny"
"If one thing matters, everything matters" - from the book The ShackOctober 20, 2013 at 10:30 am #258026newkitmanParticipant
So Ed. This Soob engine is mounting in the rear like a vw? I never in a million years would have thought of that!
VW based 53MGTD - "MoneyPenny"
"If one thing matters, everything matters" - from the book The ShackOctober 20, 2013 at 10:53 am #258027
Thanks, Bill. 83k on it now but, she’s nearing 20 years old. I’ll look into the head gasket change out.Allen: Subaru swaps into VWs is a 20-year-old thing. Soob makes some very strong turbo 4s and also flat sixes, and people have been mating them to VW/Porsche transaxles since the early Clinton administration, at least. A favorite swap is an EJ22 or EJ25 into a VW Bus. Solves myriad problems with both the old air-cooled jobbies and the Wasserboxer, which tends to blow head gaskets.The EJ22 of the early 1990s is one of the easiest swaps because the engine’s dimensions are very close to the Type 1: slightly shorter longitudinally; within a half-inch in width and much shorter up top but with a low-hanging oil pan–the main drawback for us. The short pan I bought cost $350 (ouch!) and will still leave me with a 2-inch lower-hanging engine than I have now. With the existing suspension it looks like I’ll still have about 5-inches clearance below the bottom of the pan though.The weight penalty is negligible. Here is how it breaks down, as I understand it:Type1 dressed-out (carbs, tins) weight: 265lbsEJ22 empty weight: 280lbsThe Soob has more oil in it: add 6lbsSoob has water in it: 8 lbsThat makes the back-end weight 30lbs more with the Soob. But:Type1 stock starter is heavier than the IMI HyTorque -5 lbsType 1 generator vs Soob alternator -5 lbsSo the road-going rear-end weight penalty should be closer to 20 lbsAdd the cooling stuff–2 more gallons of anti freeze: 16lbs20 feet of schedule 40 aluminum pipe, radiator and fan: 50 lbsVarious brackets and wires and junk: 25 lbs (conservatively).So the whole shebang should gain me 100 lbs, only 20-25 of which will be hanging out behind the rear wheels.The weight distribution ought to improve, if only slightly.October 20, 2013 at 12:03 pm #258028
Have you sourced out a radiator yet and given thought to mounting it and the plumbing? That looks to me to be the hardest part of the conversion!
It is interesting that VW got such a bad rap for their head gasket problems with the Wasserboxer in the vanagon when Subaru had similar problems with theirs during those years. In both cases it was caused by the phosphates in the anti-freeze attacking the aluminum causing corrosion and leaking head gaskets. One has to consider too that the little 1.9 and 2.1 wasserboxers were working their ass’s off pushing that big van around! In my opinion the VW wasser is a brilliant choice to replace a type 1 vw almost a direct bolt in and iy keeps your machine all VW.
I own and love a 2012 subaru outback and I’d surely install one if the wasserboxer wasn’t available!October 20, 2013 at 4:42 pm #258029
No radiator yet, Eddy. Probably I will end up with a more modern rad turned sideways with a fill bottle as the highest point. The stock Legacy unit is about 15 x 32 inches and could probably be made to fit about six inches behind the existing grrill, but it would hang low. I’m looking for a grid about 14 x 27. Once I have that I’ll get a rad shop to adjust the filler neck if needed.The plumbing is probably 1.5-inch Schedule 40 aluminum pipe, with some mix & match radiator hoses attached at each end. But maybe not: I am thinking about doing something with aluminum rectangular tubing to tuck it up a little.Either way, the long run from front to back will increase the cooling capacity enough so a smaller radiator will work fine–especially since Bridget weighs half what a Subaru Legacy weighs.October 20, 2013 at 10:48 pm #258030
Some of the beetle guys have managed to fit the coolant pipes up through the tunnel. sounds like it’s quite a job but it sure would be the neatest! My car has quite good ground clearance so I don’t think 1.5″ shd 40 pipe would be much of a problem down there! It’s not like we are offroading like a buggy!October 20, 2013 at 10:53 pm #258031
How about aluminum EMT ? or even galvanized, I wonder if the galvanize would react with the anti-freeze in any negative way? Getting a rad to work shouldn’t be too much of a problem, we do have quite a bit of room up there! Should be excellent airflow too.October 21, 2013 at 8:25 am #258032
David Stroud used a mid 1990s Saab 900 radiator in his Speedster. Says it’s 14 x 20 inches. Looks like a $130 part.That’s probably my ticket.As for running coolant lines through the tunnel? Not bloody likely. I was, however, thinking about how maybe thick-walled aluminum square pipes could be strong enough to use as structural members along the outsides of the pan–if clamped in right and cross-braced.But that’s not likely to happen either.October 21, 2013 at 9:14 am #258033Dale SchumacherParticipant
Ed,I just replaced my sons Honda Civic Rad in his 1997 – cost 69.00 from Auto Zone or Carquest.Seems to me about that size – I can measure if you need. I am sure there are many out there that will fit.October 21, 2013 at 9:16 am #258034
Yes. right down the middle both sides of the spine looks like the easiest and best for mine. I am tempted try mounting a radiator above the engine like the limk I posted and see if that works ok. I would involve a lot less modification to the car!October 21, 2013 at 11:23 am #258035
I think this radiator will fit quite well in my Fiberfab!http://www.ebay.ca/itm/BLACK-SERIES-DUAL-CORE-ALUMINUM-2-ROW-RADIATOR-FAN-CIVIC-DEL-SOL-92-00-EK-EM-EJ-/380689844466?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item58a2e208f2&vxp=mtr
PMOSSBERG2013-10-21 11:57:40October 21, 2013 at 12:12 pm #258036
Thanks Paul! I’ll have to learn how to do that!!October 21, 2013 at 2:22 pm #258037Paul MossbergKeymaster
No worries.Sometimes the forum software recognizes a web address and makes it a live link automatically.Other times, it doesn’t.I’ve yet to figure out why.But…here’s what you do…
You can also make any word or phrase a link:
- Type or copy/paste the link.
- Highlight the entire link, and click the button in the toolbar above the text pane.
- Click OK in the popup.
- Highlight the word/phrase.
- Click the button, and paste the web address into address field.
- The software will include “http://” automatically. So do not include that as part of the address.
Former Owner of a 1981 Classic Roadsters Ltd. Duchess (VW)
2005 Intermeccanica Roadster
If you own a TDr and are not in the Registry, please go to https://tdreplica.com/forums/topic/mg-td-replica-registry/ and register (you need to copy and paste the link)October 21, 2013 at 3:13 pm #258038
Eddy, nice find. Could you tell me the dimensions?October 21, 2013 at 3:25 pm #258039
They are listed in the ad, scroll down, 14.5″ x 16.5″ x 1.75″ Comes complete with fan etc.
I found another one that is 18.5″ high, http://www.ebay.ca/itm/1992-1993-1994-1995-1996-2000-Honda-Civic-Radiator-2-ROW-MT-28mm-Inlet-outlet-/200976674973?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2ecb24b09d&vxp=mtr It might work but getting quite close to your steering. It is from Canada so would suit me better!October 21, 2013 at 6:15 pm #258040Montie HendersonParticipant
Years ago my brother mounted a Ford 94 hsp Cortina engine in his baha bug. Radiator was incorporated in the rear bumper. Looked really strange going down the road and he had problems keeping the ft end on the ground (wheelies at start and just about every gear). It was lots of fun and FAST. We were lots younger then too 20 something. He still has the car but it’s had several motor changes since.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.